Leadership, Communication, and Veracity with Rob Hoskins (Part 2)

Mark Cole: Welcome to the John Maxwell Leadership Podcast. I am so glad you’re back with us. Mark Cole here, and I am in Guatemala with John Maxwell and Rob Hoskins. In fact, today is part two. Now, if that sounds new to you, that’s because you’re either new to the podcast, welcome. We’re glad you’re here. Or it’s because you played hookie last week. And either way you need to go back and listen to the episode last week of part one with John Maxwell and Rob Hoskins. 

You’ll find out why we’re sitting backstage in Guatemala, you’ll hear a little bit of what prompted this podcast. In fact, Rob, they’re going to get to hear your story and what you’re all about. I can go ahead and tell you, you’re going to want to go to onehope.net, because there you’re going to find out a lot about what Rob Hoskins is doing for the next generation. You’re going to get to actually see some of the faith oriented material that Rob and his team work on day in and day out. 

But all of that is history, because that was last podcast episode. Today is fresh recording, fresh lessons, and fresh information. If you listened in last week you know there is magic that’s going to happen today as Rob Hoskins and John Maxwell talk about what they’re learning, and what they’re excited about. 

Now, John, I’m going to start with Rob today, but I just got to throw it to you, because our podcast listeners love it when you come in unplugged and giving something that you’re learning. Glad to have you with us today. 

John Maxwell: Hey, this is very exciting. And Mark, you really made a great call on the last podcast, because when I’m with Rob, I just learn so much from him. And I think the greatest growth tool, let me just take a moment on this, because you know I’m passionate about personal growth. And I mean, I read to personal grow, I ask questions, I do interviews, I go to podcast, I go to events. I mean, all the ways that we have of personal growth, but I feel for me the greatest way to grow exponentially, is just to get in a room with other people that have the same heart that I have for purpose and passion, and then just take a subject and start talking about it. 

And you have heard me talk out of my book on Thinking For A Change, or How Successful People Think now, what it’s called, is that shared thinking is a multiplier. That, if I have a good idea, Mark, you have a good idea and Rob, you have a good idea, all of a sudden everything begins to multiply for me. 

And for so long as a young leader I had a mistake of trying to figure it out myself, because I felt that I needed to have answers for people. And I found out that if I would just ask other people, they would just take that thought so quickly to a whole nother level that I would have ever thought. And so, today to be with you, Rob, to be with you, Mark, this will be magic and I’m going to let you get to Rob, so that he can start the magic show. 

Mark Cole: Yeah, and like I said last week we were recently having a lunch and you two, as well as some of our equip John Maxwell Leadership Foundation partners, just began to talk around the table. And the idea of part one of this podcast episode came about, and then today we’re part two, and here’s the question, gang. This is what I want to share with our podcast listeners today. What are you excited about? What are you learning right now? And Rob, would love to hear something that you’re learning. 

Rob Hoskins: Yeah. Thanks Mark, again for letting me be on this podcast. I mean, I listen to it. I’m one of your great listeners to this podcast. Listen to it every week and obviously John’s been a great mentor in my life. But this is the first time I get to actually talk to the podcast. 

Mark Cole: Glad you’re here. Where you been? 

John Maxwell: It’s about time, Rob. About time. 

Rob Hoskins: Yeah. I mean, just so many things. I think like John, every time I’m with John, it doesn’t matter where we are. We can be sitting on a boat watching, in between holes on a golf course, or we went to the French Open once. Remember that? 

John Maxwell: Oh, that was beautiful. Wow. 

Rob Hoskins: And I think we were with that French crowd at the French Open. We were the most obnoxious attenders that have ever attended the French Open, because we just sit next to each other, we started talking to each other. 

John Maxwell: Well, we do French Open plus. It’s that plus that’s different. 

Rob Hoskins: We could do a podcast from the French Open during the match. 

John Maxwell: We could. 

Rob Hoskins: Yeah, and get all these angry looks from these French people. 

Mark Cole: That sounds like I have to go be a part of it this time. 

Rob Hoskins: Wherever we are, there’s that truth bomb that says, “Iron sharpens iron.” And just, whenever I’m with John, anywhere, we start a conversation and I just walk away learning. And then I always go home and I just start taking notes. I just take the time. When I’m in the moment I don’t, because I don’t want to miss the energy of the conversation, but tonight I’ll go home, and I’ll go home, I’ll go back to the hotel room and I’ve already got in my mind some key points that help me remember something John said. And I’ll just unpack that for a while, and just sit on it for a while. 

And so, that’s what’s great about these kind of relationships, and John, thank you for all you’ve taught me through the years. We just did a book tour. 

John Maxwell: You talk about the French Open. When you and I have conversation we just take turns serving. I mean, we really do. 

Rob Hoskins: Yeah, we do. 

John Maxwell: And what I love about it, is whoever serves the other guy hits it right back across that net. Hey, I mean, we get some good [inaudible 00:05:25] going. Don’t we? 

Rob Hoskins: We do. We do. And we just did this book tour together not too long ago for Change Your World, and I asked John this. I said, “Hey, John. Would you do me a favor during the book tour.” I really believe, John, he is, and most of us probably listening would agree. John is the greatest populist communicator of our generation. I teased John on the book tour and said, “Of the last three generations.” 

John Maxwell: That was so nasty. There was nothing pure about that, Rob. He was just killing me. 

Rob Hoskins: You’ve been the greatest populist communicator of the last two centuries, is what I said. 

John Maxwell: Yes you did. Yeah. 

Rob Hoskins: Because you have overlapped two centuries. 

Mark Cole: It had to catch a taxi to the next ride three hours away, because we were not letting him on the plane. 

John Maxwell: Exactly. As much as we had fun insulting each other, if it would have been, “You can’t ride on the plane to the next city.” We wouldn’t even had a plane. 

Rob Hoskins: We would have both been in cars traveling, driving to the next city. There would have been no plane for us. We were insulting each other off the plane. That’s for sure. 

Mark Cole: That’s when you know you’re good friends. Right? 

John Maxwell: That’s exactly right. 

Mark Cole: The level of insults that [crosstalk 00:06:32] on one another. 

John Maxwell: That’s exactly right. 

Rob Hoskins: John, I just said, “Hey, John. I’m going to be with you for the next nine, 10 days.” And like I said, one of the great communicators of all time. And I just said, “Would you do me a favor, and every time after I speak when we get back on the plane would you just really be as honest, transparent, brutal as you can be to help me become a better speaker and communicator?” 

Now, I’ve been a speaker my whole life. My father’s an amazing communicator. He’s a very different style than John, so I learned a style of communication from my father that I adapted, and I have my own style of communication. But what I said is, “John, I know that there are things, when you hear me speak where you go, “I could make him better.” And I said, “I don’t want you to hold that back from me. I want you to give me those.” 

And so, after I would speak I’d get on the plane and John, in a loving way would just begin to take apart how I said what I said. And I’ll tell you what, John, that was several months ago. I have had people, not knowing what I had experienced on that book tour, say, “What happened to you?” 

Mark Cole: Oh wow. 

John Maxwell: This is beautiful. 

Rob Hoskins: “Something changed.” They couldn’t quite pinpoint what it was, but it was me taking away those four or five central nuggets of what you taught me during the book tour about communication. That have changed my life forever. And what’s changed is my ability to connect with people through communication in a way that I never could before. I just wanted to publicly thank you, John, for that gift you have given to me, that has made me better. And you’ve done that several times in my life, but I just wanted to give the listeners, just the example of how John has added value to my life.  

That was just an extra, that’s not the one thing I wanted to talk about. 

Mark Cole: Let me come to that, because the podcast listeners know I give this application a lot, Rob. And I’m going to come to you, John, with a question. I am going to come back to what you’re learning. But I was on that trip and I got to hear John be, as you said, brutal in some input to you. But really, it was in love. It was really to help be better and I was in that, and I related with you, because of the many times, and again, our podcast listeners know of John putting me on his stage, in his spotlight, holding his microphone. And then critiquing me after that. Way before I was ready to communicate at that level. 

And then lovingly help me become better. Here’s the question, John. You just heard Rob, I’m a testament of that, our podcast listeners know you’re such a positive person. How do you put aside that positivity and get so brutal sometimes? I’m just kidding. But seriously. 

John Maxwell: Yeah. That’s a good question. 

Mark Cole: You’re a positive person. How do you put away that positivity for a moment and get so transparent and clear when Rob and I asked you to do that? 

John Maxwell: Well, first of all, I would think that the word brutal is not a good choice. But I’ll go back to brutal in a second. I think the word is truthful. Just speak truth. Let me tell you why it wasn’t brutal, because you asked me to help you. 

Mark Cole: Yeah. 

Rob Hoskins: Mm-hmm (affirmative). 

John Maxwell: Let me tell you what’s brutal. Advice that is either unwelcomed, not wanted, or not accepted. That’s brutal. 

Mark Cole: Wow. 

John Maxwell: There was nothing brutal about it, but it was very open, very honest, very truthful. But it was because of you, Rob. And I thought to myself, because that was a wonderful, I enjoyed sharing. But what I really enjoyed, Rob, is watching, literally, every time when you got back on stage, I could see that the things I was sharing with you, that you were already picking up on it, and you were very quickly showing me improvement. 

Now, Mark, it took years to do this. 

Mark Cole: Back to brutal. Back to brutal. I didn’t want to hear that. 

John Maxwell: This is so funny. I wish this was on film, because what’s so funny, is when I just did that to Mark, just did that, he had just taken a drink of water. And honest to god, Mark, I thought it was going to be spit out all over your computer and all over the table. And that was totally brutal. But the point of it is, Rob, you just continually improve. But it goes back to the fact, you wouldn’t have had any help at all, if you wouldn’t have asked for it. 

I wouldn’t walk in your life, because you’re already a very good communicator. What business is it to me to go into somebody’s life that’s already, in many ways excelled much more than me, and try to improve them without them ask. It was the fact that you asked, and for all of our podcast listeners here’s the question I want you to ask yourself, because I just asked myself that question when you were telling your story, Rob. 

And here’s the question I want you to ask yourself. How many times have I missed improvement opportunities, because I don’t have a teachable spirit? I mean, I’m not talking to you now, I’m talking about myself. How many times has John Maxwell, how many times have I, I could have left an engagement much richer, much more improved, but I wouldn’t humble myself or I was unaware of myself, just to look at somebody and say, “Could you help me?” 

And I think of all the people that could have helped me, but they didn’t. Not because they were callous, but because I never opened the door and asked to help you. Everything that you taught us a moment ago, Rob, was because it started with, “John, we’re going to have nine days together and we’re going to be teaching together, could you tweak me a little bit and see how we go?” 

And so, what I want you to see is, improvement is only possible when the person really seeks guidance and asks questions, and has a teachable spirit. 

Rob Hoskins: Wow. So good, John. I was asking myself the same exact question you did, and I was just sitting here thinking, “What are some of my regrets? And why did I miss those opportunities?” And if I’m truthful I’ll probably say because of my insecurity. 

John Maxwell: Sure. 

Rob Hoskins: Because here I am with someone I highly respect, that I want to respect me, that I want to have a relationship with, so in many cases I start running through my mind, the persona that I wish this person would have of me. What is the picture that this great leader has of me? And if I ask for help, it might diminish who he thinks I am. 

And boy, when I was younger, John, I missed so many opportunities, because of my insecurity of wanting that person to think highly of me. And I just started learning that if I could get rid of that insecurity, what I found from great leaders that have impacted my life, like you. The moment I was transparent and said, “Hey, I really need help in this area.” That’s when I saw those leaders, something come alive inside of their eyes. 

John Maxwell: No question. 

Rob Hoskins: And suddenly, they would lean in and go, “Okay, here’s someone that can receive something from me.” And I saw their attention, and not only that. 

John Maxwell: Oh yes. 

Rob Hoskins: It wasn’t only that at that particular moment there was this sense of joy and impartation, I call it. That great leaders have. They have a great joy in imparting something to others. I saw that they wanted to do that. And so, I just started inviting. But here’s what I didn’t realize would happen. It has created long-term relationships with those leaders that I never could have had, if I hadn’t shown the humility of a teachable spirit to them. 

John Maxwell: No question. You are so right. In fact, that was your connecting link. I can go back to when I was in my 20s and I was invited to a conference of large church pastors. And I think I was 28, and my church had just become the 10th largest church in America. So, I’m a kid, and I go to Orlando and all of the pastors, I’m 28, all the pastors would have been 55 or older. Except me. 

And so, we sat around the table and it was cult exchange. And they would just ask questions. And there were two questions I wanted to ask, but I was intimidated, because I thought, “Oh my gosh. I’m the new kid on the block and they know so much more.” And I left that conference, you talk about a big loss, I never asked those two questions. 

And as I drove from Orlando Florida to Lancaster Ohio, which was probably about a nine hour drive, I self talked all the way back. And I said, “I’m never going to do that again. That was once, and it was a loss. But if I appear foolish to some people, if I certainly appear immature to some people, it’s okay. I’m going to ask the question, because I want to learn. I want to grow and improve my life more than I want to worry about what somebody thinks of who I am and what I think.” 

And so, that was a big change for me. We’ve been where you are. And I think everybody has been, and I think the lesson on this is, is just be teachable, humble yourself and be teachable, because you’re going to find all kind of help the moment you ask for help. 

Mark Cole: And specific to communication, I’m sitting here, John, as Rob’s talking about the impact your mentoring had on his communication, the impact you’ve had on my communication. I’m sitting here going, “Boy, in our podcast world there are a ton of people that communicate in a leadership meeting to, few people, to many people.” And it reminds me of the product that you and Steve Harvey created called Elevate Your Communication. 

John Maxwell: Yes. 

Mark Cole: And it’s a product that John, Steve Harvey. 

John Maxwell: Oh, it’s hilarious. 

Mark Cole: It’s hilarious. And incredibly helpful. 

John Maxwell: It has to be hilarious. 

Mark Cole: And so, for those of you that just resonate with myself and Rob. 

Rob Hoskins: But, by the way. On the hilarious point. That’s one of the things you taught me on the tour, was you didn’t come out and say this to me, but I saw you do it and then I asked you about it later. And it’s something I’m not very good at, but I’ve been trying since then, and it’s worked. And the best type of humor is self-depreciating humor. 

John Maxwell: Depreciating. Oh yes. Best by far. 

Rob Hoskins: And I’ve tried that more and more, and it works. It’s like self-depreciating humor is the best. 

John Maxwell: Self-depreciating humor is only talking about yourself in a way that people already see you. 

Rob Hoskins: And you know what I found out? There’s no shortage of content there. I’ve got enough self-depreciating to last for the rest of my life. 

John Maxwell: And what it does, Rob, what it does, is it closes the gap. When you become successful, sadly, that people put a gap. They put a distance between you and them. And I think anyone that’s successful, their first intentionality is to close that gap as quick as they possibly can. No one ever helped anyone from a distance. It’s only when you come close. 

Rob Hoskins: And what I saw was, the colder the room was that we would go into, the more you would take the time at the beginning to warm that room up. 

John Maxwell: That’s right. 

Rob Hoskins: And you almost always did it in two ways. And this is what you taught me on the plane. Lessons you taught me on the plane. One of them was that self-depreciating thing, and the second was to get closer to them. The colder the room was, the closer you needed to get to everybody. And you just broke down all those barriers, and let me tell you, listeners on the podcast today. Those things have worked for me. This is only three months ago. 

John Maxwell: Yeah. 

Rob Hoskins: And it’s really transforming the way I communicate, so thank you, John, for these incredible principles. 

Mark Cole: Yeah, and if you’d like to take advantage of that … 

Rob Hoskins: Sorry, I jumped in. 

Mark Cole: John taught you to communicate so well, that you’re doing quite well with it, Rob. 

John Maxwell: He’s really taking that jump in and interrupting communication. 

Mark Cole: Elevate Your Communication with Steve Harvey, John Maxwell. Go to johnmaxwell.com. You’ll be able to pick up that. I know it will help you, and Rob, you are exactly right. John is a master at leaning in and connecting. Hey, go to this. I want to catch this before we run out of time. What are you learning? What are you learning right now? 

Rob Hoskins: You asked what am I learning and what am I most excited about. And something I learned led to something I’m most excited about. Let me just give you a little bit about what I’m most excited about, and then tell you in re-engineering or going back and dissecting why this particular project has been so successful, is because of this principle. And I’m learning it more and more every day. 

The thing I’m most excited about right now, is a new project that OneHope has recently launched called The Kid’s Bible Experience. Kid’s Bible Experience, and KB, we call it. And it’s on the YouVersion platform.  

Mark Cole: It’s an app that they can pick up? 

Rob Hoskins: Well, the YouVersion is the platform that it sits on, and it’s a program that sits on the YouVersion app. 

Mark Cole: Good. 

Rob Hoskins: But it’s particularly geared in this partnership between OneHope and YouVersion to give a great experience to kids from the ages of seven to 11. 

Mark Cole: Love it. 

Rob Hoskins: This is a very distinct Gen Z, these seven to 11 year olds, think different than prior generations do. Right? And OneHope’s done a ton of research on them. So much research went into us creating this program that we call Kid’s Bible Experience. Now, the cool thing about it, there were several principles that we had to learn about Gen Z. One of those is, okay, they have more access to knowledge than any generation in the history of humanity. 

They have more media rich experience than any generation. They’re the YouTube generation. We were like, “How do you engage that type of generation, that has so much access to knowledge and just has had an experience with media like no other generation? How are you going to make something exciting for them? How do you compete with Disney, and everything else and bring the bible alive to them?” 

And really, we were thinking, “This is probably the most media savvy generation in the history of humanity. And how are we going to make the bible come alive to them on a daily, consistent basis?” That was a challenge for us. And it comes back to what I learned. Long story, short, I’m most excited about it because it worked. 

Kid’s Bible Experience just launched. We were in beta. And so, we just launched it a couple weeks ago, and we already, this week, are going to pass one million unique users. 

Mark Cole: Wow. 

Rob Hoskins: Which, anybody that knows anything about digital and creating this, and here’s what I’m most excited about. Upwards of 70% stickiness. What that means is, they’re not just downloading it, they’re actually continually coming back on more than a weekly basis to the content over, so it’s working. Why did it work? And it comes down to this principle that now has been confirmed in me. 

I thought it, but now it’s been confirmed in me. And that is, that in the age in which we live, the digital age, and the 21st century is all about open systems. The 20th century was really about closed systems, and it was all about, and if you’re a leader, if you’re a communicator, if you’re creating your own intellectual property, if you’re creating your own content I want you to hear me right now, because the way, and John, I’d love for you to speak into this, because obviously you’ve written 80 something books, millions of copies sold. You’re one of the great content producers of our time.  

I mean, you’re a machine on it, so you know a lot about this. But if you try and control that content, like we did in the 20th century and the 21st century, you’re not going to have the influence that you really desire in your life. Because in the digital age of transformation that we’re living in, and here’s what I found. Leaders of the future, if they’re stingy with their content, are going to limit their influence. 

John Maxwell: Absolutely. 

Rob Hoskins: Now, in the open system age the more generous you are with your content in every way, the larger your platform is going to be. And what I found is, that most content providers today that are stingy with their content are going to try and control what they have, and completely own it themselves, are really going to limit the capacity of leadership that they have moving into the future. 

And so, what we did with Kid’s Bible Experience is, we just said, “Look, we’re going to give everything away, and I’m going to go my best friends in the church world.” Because it’s a bible app. And so, I went to the most influential, best content providers I could find in the Christian world. These are the largest churches. I mean, these churches, some of them have full-time staff’s of six to 10 people, that all they do is work on content for their Sunday morning service. 

And I just went to them and I asked them, “I want you to give me your content for free.” I was bold enough to say, “Hey, look, that, that you’ve worked so hard and you’ve got a staff on, and you could hold this.” Some of them actually publish a lot of their content. These are real intellectual property that they’re creating. 

And I said, “Hey, for the common good I want you to give that content away.” Now, I think there’s a principle here for everybody. Number one is, in open systems you can’t be stingy with your content. And number two, your content on your own is never going to be as good as content that you’re providing in collaboration with others. 

I don’t care how good you are. I don’t care how big of a church you have. I don’t care how great your content is on a Sunday. What I proposed to them was, I’m going to give you a bigger platform that you’re going to grow and collaborate on, than you can ever have, no matter how big you are. 

And I had a lot of push back, even five years ago when I was presenting this, John. But I think there’s a new generation of 21st century leaders who understand the age in which we live. That if they give that content away, see, a lot of it has to do with a stingy and scarcity mentality, that a lot of people have with their own content. 

And if you’re saying, “If I give this away.” You’re saying, “I don’t have the capacity to come up with enough new, fresh content in the future.” And that’s a scarcity mentality. But what I find, is true leaders have the ability to say, “I can create great content today, and I can create better content tomorrow.” And this is what I found working with you, John. You’ve always got two or three books in you that are about to burst out of you. You have a confidence in the content that you’re going to have in the future. 

And so, what I’ve learned, if you’re out there, if you’re a listener right now, you’ve got great content. Here’s what I’d say. Number one. Be generous with that content. And if you’re generous with that content you’re going to grow your influence more than you ever have before. Number two. Find a way to collaborate with others that are in your same space on how together you can share content together, and you’re going to grow your audience far bigger than you ever can on your own or by you trying to hold what you have. 

And boy, Kid’s Bible Experience is just exploding because of that. Here’s what I found. We started out with these 50 largest churches in America and asked them to do these two to three minute YouTube type videos for us. We have to produce content every day. Now my team at OneHope doesn’t have to produce, we’re just curating content from all these, I started getting calls from churches. I had a church, Hillsong in Australia who many of you know, that actually contacted us and said, “Hey, we saw this new Kid’s Bible Experience.” 

I mean, they are probably one of the best kid producing churches in the world, and now they’re calling and they’re on the platform. I’ve got the greatest churches in the world now saying, “I can’t afford not to be part of this platform, because I can now touch what I believe is going to be multiplied millions of kids that are going to be part of the Kid’s Bible Experience.” 

And you know what? They are going to be able to have a bigger platform than they ever dreamed possible, because they gave something away. Start giving away the best of what you have, and what I’m telling you, is you’re going to grow your influence in an open system, digitally connected world. 

Mark Cole: What’s interesting, Rob, I asked you what are you learning, what you’re excited about. I think you just gave me both. That’s a pretty exciting thing that you’ve got going right there. 

John Maxwell: Mark, let me jump in here, because let me tell you something. They do go together. I’m glad you brought that up, because I was going to. I’m always excited about what I’m learning. That’s one of the reasons I learn. Some of the most boring people I know, they don’t learn anything. You have a lunch with them five years later, nobody’s home. It’s the same conversation you had with them five years earlier. 

And you cannot give what you do not have. And the only way that you can have it, is to go out and grab hold of it and learn it, and grow from it. But I really want to tell a story off of what you said. When I was a young pastor, and again, as you were listening to the podcast you know, that we were a little bit more faithy than normal, but just relax. You know us. We love you unconditionally and I learn principles from everybody. People of faith, people of no faith at all. They all have something to teach me. Okay. 

I’m in my first little church, and I do a stewardship month teaching people how to manage their time, their talents, their money, their resources. I mean, I only have a congregation of 50 people, so get the picture. It’s a little country church. But it’s a success. It really works really good, and in my little denomination the word got around that John just pulled of a great, successful stewardship month. 

And I had handouts, and I had posters, and I had things back in 1969, 1970. 

Rob Hoskins: In another century. 

John Maxwell: Yeah. Oh Rob, you’re back at it again. I walked right into that one, didn’t I? And you just picked that one up. Anyway. And so, pastors said, “Could you help us?” And my response was, “No.” Now, understand, I know I’m known for abundance and generosity, but I want you to hear the story.  

Mark Cole: I’m surprised. 

John Maxwell: I said, “No.” Because, you know what my first thought was? If I don’t tell them what I’ve got, then I’ll have an edge on them, because I had a competitive spirit. I had a competitive spirit, which basically was, instead of saying, “We’re all on the same team and we ought to collaborate.” It was like, “I know we’re all on the same team, but I would like to beat you.”  

And so, for six months I would say, “No.” And in my faith journey after a while I realized, “This is so wrong. This is so terrible.” And so, I finally got them together at a camp and about 120 pastors I sat down. And I not only shared with them how I did it, but I had resources I gave them. Every one of my resources. I gave everything away in a pack. I had packets for every one of those pastors. 

They came to me and thanked me, and said, “John, you have no idea that this is going to help me.” It was at that moment that I realized that God had given me a gift to create resources, and that part of that is to use that gift. Now, here’s the story. That forever changed me. 

I still remember walking back on that camp to my dorm and saying, “The joy I had in sharing and giving away what I have, was greater than when I did it myself.” And that’s when I realized the [inaudible 00:29:34] to take that story, it was on stewardship. Remember? 20 years later I started a stewardship company. Basically helping churches raise finances and within five to eight years we became the largest stewardship company in the world, and we raised over three billion dollars. 

Now, let me tell you something. The seed of that great company was the day I got over my selfishness, my pettiness, my smallness and said, “No, no, no. What is mine, is not mine. It is only given to me to be a reservoir or to be a river and not a reservoir.” And that was life changing for me, so I love you speaking to that. And I want people to hear that, because I think sometimes, Mark, I think people see it, Rob and me, where we are now, and one of the things I’m very uncomfortable about where I am now, is they see all the success. 

And I want to look at them and say, “I’m really not this good. I wish you could have seen me when I started off.” You’re already better than I was when I started. I can see you’re already further along. And I think, really the burden of success to me, is that the backend it compounds and accumulates, until it gets so big people can’t identify with where you are. And I want to say, “No, no. I wasn’t as bad as you think I was in the beginning, but I’m not as good as you think I am in the beginning.” 

Rob Hoskins: Wow. So good John. I’m just thinking about, whenever I feel that sense of, because it’s in all of us. Right? I mean, as leaders? I still have to check myself. I mean, sometimes. I’ll have something that I feel is a great, new idea or a great, new piece of content, and I’ll get somewhere and I’ll feel this sense of not wanting to give it away for that very reason. And whenever I feel that in my heart, I have to check myself and the question I now ask myself whenever I get that feeling in me is, “Rob, you’re feeling insecure.” 

You called it a reservoir. It’s coming out of your reservoir. And what I realized is, it’s really, whenever I get that feeling, it’s because I don’t believe that my reservoir is full enough to be able to produce something better and fresher in the next season of my life.  

And so, what I realized is, I’m feeling an insecurity about the richness of what’s inside of me. And I don’t want to be that person. I want to be that person that’s constantly replenishing the reservoir, so everything I have is overflowing out of what I have. Now, I know that when I’m generous, that confidence in that reservoir is pretty full. And if I ever start feeling that sense of, “I can’t give this away.” I know my reservoir isn’t full enough. 

John Maxwell: Yeah. That’s good. 

Rob Hoskins: And that’s a me problem, that I need to go back and keep replenishing and filling myself with. And that’s why I love being with you, John. Because your reservoir is so full always, overflowing. You’ve always got more that you want to give, so you’re not concerned about holding onto what you have, because you know there’s greater riches in the days to come for you. 

Mark Cole: John, just close us out. I mean, you may have to tease us with something you’re learning, just a little tease. And you may have to come back to a podcast and teach it. But just close us out with, maybe some other little brief snippet of what you’re learning and then we’ll go. 

John Maxwell: I will, but I have to just say one more thing on Rob. And this is a problem with you having Rob and me on the same show. We just absolutely feed off of each other, but it’s the paradox of leadership that Jesus taught. What you lose, you keep. And what you keep, you lose. And that’s exactly what we’re talking about. Can I tell you something? 

I think that only God will give to you what he knows will flow through you. I believe the abundance of the reservoir is the fact that you let it become a river. And I don’t think, once the reservoir is full you don’t get anymore until you release. It’s like breathing. Sometimes, “I want to keep everything myself.” And I suck it in, I hold it, but it’s only a matter of time until I have to let it go. But can I tell you something? 

I never can breathe in again until I let go. You have to keep them together, and the moment you separate them you get in trouble. Okay. Now, I’ll do a tease. I mean, of course Rob took up all my time. My gosh. I mean, I have something just brilliant to share. 

Rob Hoskins: I’m sorry. You’re never having me back on the show. 

John Maxwell: I’d have you back next week on the show, because let me tell you, you add so much more value than what I can give by myself. That’s a fact. Mark, he’s done great. We appreciate that. 

Mark Cole: Absolutely. 

John Maxwell: But you and I had a breakfast with Tim Elmore about six weeks ago and Tim said something that I wrote down, because I write down, basically anything that’s going to be a growing point in my life. And he said this statement, “There is no life change without life exchange.” In other words, what Tim said is, all the change and the growth in your life is a result of you exchanging with other people, conversation. 

There is no life change without life exchange. And on another time when we’re together I’ll talk to you about self-help books, and I’ll talk to you about the fact that self-help is not enough, and that if all of my life, is I just depend on myself to reach my potential here’s the teaser. It is impossible for you to reach your potential if you try to do it on your own. You have to include others to get to that level. We’ll talk about that [crosstalk 00:35:08]. 

Rob Hoskins: Oh man. I’m coming back on that one. I want to listen to that one. No. Seriously. 

John Maxwell: Well, then he’s going to ask it before you start talking. He’s going to have to ask me to go first, Rob, because if it’s you go first, then God can’t even interrupt. 

Rob Hoskins: I mean, John is probably known, like for people that don’t know him personally, as probably one of the greatest self-help gurus of the last 50 years. Of the last two centuries. To hear you say that, John, I mean people need to come back and listen to say, “Okay, here’s a guy who’s known to be the self-help guy, saying it’s not enough.” 

John Maxwell: It’s not enough. To be continued podcast listeners. To be continued. 

Mark Cole: As you can tell, there is magic that happens when Rob and John get together. If you have not picked up the Change Your World book yet, if you’re not in the community at changeyourworld.com you are missing one of the greatest collaborations in our lifetime, because it is truly changing the world. Changeyourworld.com. I mentioned earlier in the show Elevate Your Communication. All of that can be found at johnmaxwell.com. Rob, thank you so much. You added tremendous value. 

Rob Hoskins: My joy. 

John Maxwell: Thanks, Rob. I’m giving you an applause, Rob. 

Rob Hoskins: All right. That’s great. 

Mark Cole: Yeah. And John, thank you for consistently week in and week out adding value to us. 

John Maxwell: My joy. 

Mark Cole: All of you, podcast listeners, thank you. You got a bonus part one and part two. We could go to part three, four, and five. You got a bonus. We got some extra time today and you get a bonus, because you heard two great leaders collaborate on how to change the world. Hey, until next week subscribe, pass along to someone else, get someone else in this learning community, download the show notes, add value to someone else, so that they can multiply value to others. We’ll see you next week. Until then, let’s change our world.